As the title says, I am currently learning to be a programmer, and my tablet does not suffice for the job.
I have already finished a small MEAN-Stack application for learning Typescript, learned some Java syntax (I expect nothing more exciting than a sorting algorithm, but exam language is Java, so…) and the next stop will most likely be plain vanilla C to learn about handling hardware.
Windows I hate with a passion, and I don’t know squat about Macs, so I am thinking of getting myself a decently sized laptop for a sensible Linux install.
History (I started my Liux journey with SuSE Linux 4.4.1, way back when) taught me to be very wary of driver issues on laptops, so I thought I could ask you for recommendations that play fair with Linux.
(as an aside, if I could play GuildWars2 on it in the evening and attach my two big monitors when at home, that would be super cool)
I can not recommend the framework laptop enough. Love their mission of producing a reparable and user-friendly laptop. You can even buy it without windows, to install your own OS from the get go.
I’ve only heard great things about Framework (https://frame.work/) however their laptops are not cheap. I wouldn’t necessarily assume that they fit a student budget. OP didn’t say what their budget is but you can definitely get a laptop that is adequate for programming for less than half of the price. That being said if the budget is there the upgradability and repairability may make it an economical option over the long-term.
Yeah, Framework seems like a premium product for sure. I want one but I definitely can’t afford it anytime soon. Also worth noting that a new framework mainboard rivals the price of some entire laptops. So while it is definitely upgradable and one of the most repairable laptops in the world, it is still a pricy ecosystem to be in.
I had been holding off on a laptop purchase waiting for framework to ship an AMD board, but they took so long that I had to buy another laptop instead. The new models they were showing off at Computex look so cool though. I am really excited about their swappable GPUs.
old thinkpad FTW!
got a T430s for 115Euros one year ago
I would highly recommend a Framework if it’s within your budget and you care at all about right to repair. Otherwise I’d highly recommend a used Thinkpad as they hold up exceptionally. I’ve used Linux on both very smoothly.
Laptops these days do much better with Linux than before. But if you really want ~0% chance of dealing with driver issues, I’d go with System76 laptops. They’re made for Linux, and with Linux pre-installed.
Dell and Lenovo also offer laptops with Ubuntu pre-installed and supported.
can’t speak to lenovo, but i’ve had very mixed results with Dell. it certainly isn’t as smooth as system76 or the old (pre lenovo) think pads but they’re workable. the 13in dell models are better supported then the 15in in my experience
Thank you all for your suggestions, I will have a look at used thinkpads or tuxedos. Scratches never bothered me.
You are all very helpful!
Checkout Framework laptops. If they don’t do it for you, maybe try System76.
pickup a t440p for peanuts, can add more ram and processor if you want
wasn’t the t440p the I’ve that did away with the trackpoint buttons?
My usual suggestion: Get a generation-old business or workstation class machine from one of the major manufacturers, as a refurb. Mostly meaning keep an eye on Dell Refurbished or Lenovo Outlet - sometimes you can also get a deal on a refurb via woot - for something that appeals to you. The stock is always changing at those, and there are almost always sales/coupons for around 40% off at the first-party refurb stores, so +/- a week of patience can save you a bunch of money.
Business or workstation class machines (think Dell Latitude or Precision, especially the ones with models that start with a 7, or Thinkpad) are typically mechanically much better built than their consumer counterparts, and usually full of reputable components that are connected in standard ways - low end consumer stuff sometimes has issues where they got weird less-common components or connected things in stupid ways to save a few cents per unit that will cause driver issues.
Waiting a generation gives time for mainline kernel driver support to fully mature to minimize driver problems, and drastically cuts the price.
I’ve had several machines following that advice, and I think the only driver trouble I’ve had with them has been with unsupported fingerprint/smartcard readers, which I …don’t care about anyway.
Or, if you want a way cheap beater and don’t mind some hackin’, grab a used/refurbished AUE Chromebook that is on the Mr. Chromebox Supported List. AUE means they no longer receive ChromeOS updates, so their price craters to like $50, and you can flash a normal UEFI payload and use them as a (feeble, storage starved, low resolution) computer. Not a good main machine, but they make fun beaters for experimenting. There are often batches of them being dumped via woot.
…also, don’t buy anything with an Nvidia GPU unless you have a specific compelling reason, it’ll be a pain in your ass for the life of the machine.
Thank you for putting some actual student-budget options.
Thinkpads are absolute tanks and support Linux quite well. Would shy away from the T470 and T480 though. The touchpad on those isn’t really well implemented. If you don’t care about reliability my Surface Laptop Go does Fedora Silverblue 38 really well.
As someone that has to support a fleet of various ThinkPad models… just don’t get anything made in the last 5 or so years. They’re still built well, but the internal hardware is HORRIBLE - trackpads will ghost click, random keys will stop working or just fall out, thr USBC controller WILL break, and the hinges get loose and wobbly. I personally wouldn’t get one at all anymore to be honest with what I’ve had to deal with.
I’ve used pre-owned corporate thinkpads for years. At least in here we have multiple of stores to purchase previously leased (and since wiped+inspected) laptops for quite cheap (your definition of cheap may vary). Just now I have one waiting at the post office, T495 for 299€. Granted that’s never been a top line model, but it’s well sufficient for my usage and it’ll happily replace the old x240 I’ve been lugging around.
I’ve ran them with ubuntu/debian, dualboot and pretty much every combination. They just seem to work, altough there may be more or less hiccups specially with keyboard lights and (to me) minor things like that. Networking, hardware itself, suspend and everything else just works. And there’s mountains of information on various wikis etc to check before purchasing.
+1 for used thinkpads. If you can live with some scratches you can find great deals. Plus you can look up the model you would like to get on https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Laptop/Lenovo and make sure compatibility isn’t a concern.
I (and many of my colleagues) do this since I switched to laptop 7 years ago. I use them during my whole time in university (CS using Linux).
They are very reliable. And (at least the old models that I use) can be fixed manualy when something is wrong (change SSD, RAM, thermal paste,…)
If money is no issue, I would go with a framework (I have no first hand experience with them). If money is to be considered, I would go with a refurbished ThinkPad.
if you are from the EU i can recommend Tuxedo Computers. they have a wide range of laptops to fit your budget, and among those a lot of customisation options.
the only downside about mine ive noticed, would be that the keyboard legends seem to wear a bit faster than normal. then again that is because they are laser etched, which means for a small upcharge they will put whatever you want on there.
or Framework as others have mentioned, not only because they seem to have produced a great product, but also because their mission is definitely worth supporting.
I tried a Tuxedo Laptop a few years ago and the keyboard was noticeably worse than my T480s and a MX Keys Mini. But that probably depends on the model.
Don’t make the same mistake I did and get it with a good CPU. Good CPU bad GPU far outweights good GPU bad CPU
g14 6800s open box is 800 atm at bestbuy , if you’re in the US I don’t think that deal can be beat.
But we’d need to know your budget, and some more of your requirements to help more.
If you dont care about gaming, then an old thinkpad would last you the rest of your life.
any recent laptop (or even older stuff) would work pretty well with linux. just make sure that you can have access to the BIOS or UEFI. I personally like AMD hardware, but Intel and Nvidia work just as well.
if you can afford it, System 76, Framework, or other linux first manufacturers are nice, but otherwise any normal laptop should work.
If you’re bringing it to school, consider the weight and size, also the backpack you’ll put it in. Big screen is good, but more annoying to carry around. I have a tiny 13" that I bring between home and work, which works great, because apart from meetings, I never actually use the screen. Might consider the keyboard too, but unless you go apple, I feel like laptop keyboards are always gonna be “eh”
Guild Wars 2 works without issue, though if that’'s specifically what you want to play, Guild Wars 2 works better with a good CPU and an SSD, whereas the GPU would be good but doesn’t need to be great. That of course depends game per game, just I know that Guild Wars 2 specifically relies a lot on the CPU, and without a SSD it will stutter.
Personally I would try to get a ThinkPad from a bankruptcy auction or similar, I got my T15 for around $600.
